Welcome to SkydioPilots.com
Sign up and join the discussion!
Sign up

Kinda reminds me of a line in the OLD "Charlie Brown" song

Rich Z

Member
Joined
Nov 22, 2019
Messages
9
Reaction score
0
Location
Crawfordville, FL
Website
www.faunaclassifieds.com
Well, I have been looking hard at the Mavic Air 2 and come to find out that their claimed 4K 60 fps seems to be just a gimmick to get a checkbox marked in the list of specs. Come to find out that you can't use the 4K 60 fps with just about any other features the drone offers. Only reason I was looking at it was because I'm getting a bit antsy about when my number is going to come up for my Skydio. I read somewhere that now batch 3 is going to be pushing into September. Shortage of parts from China, maybe? I'm thinking that by the time I get it, the technology is going to be very old news as competitors catch up.
 

skydioconvert

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Messages
487
Reaction score
91
Well, I have been looking hard at the Mavic Air 2 and come to find out that their claimed 4K 60 fps seems to be just a gimmick to get a checkbox marked in the list of specs. Come to find out that you can't use the 4K 60 fps with just about any other features the drone offers. Only reason I was looking at it was because I'm getting a bit antsy about when my number is going to come up for my Skydio. I read somewhere that now batch 3 is going to be pushing into September. Shortage of parts from China, maybe? I'm thinking that by the time I get it, the technology is going to be very old news as competitors catch up.
Wouldn't surprise me that Batch 3 gets pushed out into September but I doubt very much that DJI will match Skydio's OA anytime soon. With the US governments push against Chinese products and DJI becoming more and more China-centric good money says that American drone companies are well positioned to take a bigger and bigger share of the drone market.
 

Portolo

Active member
Joined
Jun 29, 2020
Messages
38
Reaction score
11
With the US governments push against Chinese products and DJI becoming more and more China-centric good money says that American drone companies are well positioned to take a bigger and bigger share of the drone market.
Agree completely.

Which is why the new X2 appears to be the company's future.

I doubt very much that DJI will match Skydio's OA anytime soon.
Disagree.

Suspect DJI get close, or close enough, relatively soon. Which is why Skydio appears to be prioritizing X2 over consumer products.

Once DJI is close enough, Skydio will not be able to compete on price in the consumer sphere. But fortunately, the US and western governments represent a large market with deep pockets. Skydio is well positioned to lead in government and enterprise, and not just in the US.

This is why when my order comes up, am very much on the fence about going through with it. Suspect there's a good chance that Skydio 2 will be their last consumer product.
 
Last edited:

skydioconvert

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Messages
487
Reaction score
91
When the worlds number one drone manufacturer still can't counter what Skydio's done regarding OA after trying for almost a year I doubt they're even close.

Suspect that Skydio has a few tricks up their sleeve that will make even an S3 or an S4 probable.

Improvements made in the commercial design more often than not flow down into consumer versions of the product.
 

Portolo

Active member
Joined
Jun 29, 2020
Messages
38
Reaction score
11
When the worlds number one drone manufacturer still can't counter what Skydio's done regarding OA after trying for almost a year I doubt they're even close.
Hardly a typical year. DJI's development progress was likely slowed during the pandemic, just like so many firms.

But if DJI is unable to release a reasonable facsimile of Skydio's OA in the next 6 to 8 months, then Skydio should continue to have a viable consumer product.

But if DJI does develop OA that's even close to that of Skydio's, hard to see how it wouldn't price Skydio out of the consumer market.

Skydio's management clearly doesn't want to bet the firm's future on an agile competitor like DJI, not executing. Which is why Skydio's move to enterprise makes so much sense. It's also why Skydio 2 may be their final act in the consumer space.
 

VEGASROBBI

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 26, 2019
Messages
195
Reaction score
125
But if DJI does develop OA that's even close to that of Skydio's, hard to see how it wouldn't price Skydio out of the consumer market.
Based on their current offerings I don't think DJI is anywhere close to Skydio on OA or AI. It's not just avoiding obstacles but how it negotiates the environment at high speed.

My M2 is the newest DJI drone I have and neither it's hardware or software is capable of S2 like performance. If DJI has an all new bird under wraps with new hardware, processers and the AI required to match Skydio I would be surprised.
 
  • Like
Reactions: skydioconvert

skydioconvert

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Messages
487
Reaction score
91
But if DJI is unable to release a reasonable facsimile of Skydio's OA in the next 6 to 8 months, then Skydio should continue to have a viable consumer product.
.... and your basis for the 6-8 month estimate is???
 

Portolo

Active member
Joined
Jun 29, 2020
Messages
38
Reaction score
11
.... and your basis for the 6-8 month estimate is???
Next full product cycle, after factoring in the pandemic delay.

And really, they don't have to be as good as Skydio to tie up the consumer market. Reasonably good OA at a far lower price would likely be enough.
 
Last edited:

skydioconvert

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Messages
487
Reaction score
91
Not into just guessing .... even "experts" get it more wrong than right.
 

Portolo

Active member
Joined
Jun 29, 2020
Messages
38
Reaction score
11
Not into just guessing ....
Assuming DJI will fail to execute is no less of a guess.

My guess is that DJI will achieve limited success with OA. Not as good as Skydio, but good enough for most consumers, and at a far lower price.

The problem DJI cannot innovate their way out of is China's dictatorial regime. Which is why Skydio's enterprise future looks bright. Their consumer future? Likely depends on whether DJI executes or not.
 

skydioconvert

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Messages
487
Reaction score
91
Wow.... walking away now.... you apparently need the last word so I'm giving it to you.
 

Ridefreak

Well-known member
Wiki Editor
Joined
Nov 20, 2019
Messages
319
Reaction score
167
I don't think they'll bail on the consumer market. It's what put them on the map but the new corporate version shouldn't be a surprise, it's going to be a goal of any drone company and they alluded to commercial applications when the SD2 was first announced. Just my opinion but I think you'll see some features of the commercial model show up in the consumer version. The folding design, longer battery life, night vision and improved controller would be easy to port over to the consumer version. I doubt it'd be $999 but I would still consider one within reason price-wise. I think they purposely made the price low on the S2 to get visibility and penetration, that probably won't last.
 
  • Like
Reactions: VEGASROBBI

skydioconvert

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Messages
487
Reaction score
91
Agree with everything you've said.... makes sense to have feet in both the consumer and commercial camps.
 

dougcjohn

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 13, 2019
Messages
91
Reaction score
22
Age
62
This often comes around, New product overtaking Big Dog Brand... not tracking on that, currently they don’t serve the same market. Little “overlap” in one narrow offering but beyond that not even competitors... I doubt DJI is overly concerned... probably more how they want to position their product to hold majority or minimize the impact of Skydio. They’ve pushed out several Others over the years with multiple tactics. The Govt market is a separate market, and I’m not positive that‘s even a closed chapter.

I’ve had an S2 for about 10 months, RC & Beacon. It’s a great craft... When OA with quick AI is a primary need of mission. Tracking as example a subject (self & bike) without controlling is awesome & impressive! Still amazed watching it perform in that manor! Rarely use the S2, that feature isn’t high on my list of needs... nice to have, but not a primary.

Overall, so far the S2 is more limited by 3rd party software or mission capabilities in OEM SW & the RC. It’s not come close to replacing my DJI crafts. The S2 is a Great craft, but I don’t see it giving the DJI products direct competition across the multitude of operations DJI Support’s. As Skydio continues to offer a few subscription specialty modules... many, including myself will use other platforms without subscriptions. To some shops, these services with the S2 will be greatly received... but those Shops may also qualify for the X2 purchases... not obtainable by small shops. I’m also one that feels Skydio has obtained their goal... Govt Contracts and they’ll slowly exit consumer market; It’s just not as profitable as a Govt contract with low volume products.

One major negative... also apparent on the X2. The S2 is worthless in low light or darkness... refuses to even take off in any manual mode. The X2 allows low light flight, loosing the Optical OA and switching to other sensors or GPS with stipulated less OA available. That Optical deficit probably effects usefulness in smoke, fog, etc too... removing many missions: SAR, Fire, etc.

The need for OA isn’t always a function needed, I rarely have it “on” for most projects with other platforms: DJI (several platforms) & Yuneec H520... often find having OA on hindering the mission. It’s not needed on missions supported: construction surveys, modeling, capture video via POI or Waypoints.

Actually prior to the Mavic series... back in Phantom heyday and Inspire 1; DJI did show a R&D project using Optical OA 360 sphere around the craft. It didn’t drum much interest at the time for the projected cost or User requests and was shelved. I don’t believe including Optical OA would be overly challenging if you examine some of their Ag products and other vertical products not marketed in USA or consumer markets. Their assessment on ROI and market is a strong consideration... particularly if they aren’t currently gaining Govt accounts... “currently”; they’ed be more focused on pro-consumer & retail.

DJI has acquired many USA located structures and land over the years. They warehouse inventory and Service Centers in USA. It wouldn’t be difficult to relocate some production to USA to easily meet the “Assembled in USA“ or “Made in USA” requirements. Currently several of the chosen USA sUAV products are “Assembled in USA”, not technically USA made.

IMO: The Govt politics effected the Chinese product more than any other factor. If truly a matter of Chinese parts, then better address cellular devices, GPS hardware, WiFi & LAN hardware, IT hardware, etc that has a lot more exposure than sUAV.

Still, the S2 is a great craft for some purposes!
 

dougcjohn

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 13, 2019
Messages
91
Reaction score
22
Age
62
Ever noticed the number of members on Skydio forum... 3, 7... normally less than 20. Mavic forum... 200-1500 avg, rarely see it under 200 at 2am. Market Share indirectly indicated.
 

skydioconvert

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Messages
487
Reaction score
91
A similar comment could have been made many years ago when comparing foreign cars with the American juggernaut automobile industry.

We all know how that turned out.

P.S. Also if you're not logged in while viewing the forum you don't show up in the viewer count.
 

dougcjohn

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 13, 2019
Messages
91
Reaction score
22
Age
62
Good Rebuttal: I was around back in those days and that's not really a similar comparison... labor market, etc were more critical variables. American Manufacturing was first... we took it too Japan to make it cheaper; taught, coached, and built their auto enterprise. If looking for a auto example, kinda-sorta.... in a crude way: AM General and the HMMWV (Humvee) was a Govt only focused Company that had it's day... then decayed, sold and decayed again, sold, tried public and decayed again. The '60's Foreign Car market... Japan low grade got attention for price but certainly not quality, durability or safety and Japan didn't have control of the USA market... other way around. Nobody argued a Datsun was a quality car with more potential than a Chevy... Nobody felt the Datsun was even a Good Car (Loved my 240Z), like any Japan cars their best trait was Rust... they were just dirt cheap! Incomparison the Big 3 Dogs of USA... their 20-50's could sit in water for years and still have more steel in the body. Jump forward to 90's... Asian Companies succeeded due to many reasons... fresh design ideas weren't the primary, it was more business practice of economics.

ON the sUAV Forums... actually it shows loged-in and guests for total count. Plus the point is what... it's still less than 20 on avg and Mavic Forum avg 400... low 200 Logged in, up to 2000 at a time.

No question the S2 is great, Skydio is attempting to be successful... but visualize DJI for a moment creating a new company: "DJI USA" or "Superior Drone", transferring a few 1000 employees over to USA, and on their Owned land build a living society, setup manufacturing of close identical parts except molded, punched, cut, polished and soldered & created in USA. The DJI USA company is now competitive and easily within the regulations of Govt. Their price point I'm confident would be much lower than Other USA based companies. They could mimic their designs within USA production and get past a new company growth in short fashion. That may be a route that is being constructed currently.

No one actually "using" the DJI products within the Govt wanted to give up their inventory (actually they don't have to yet, it's a life cycle event) they were directed by a mandate to begin purchase agreements with other companies. Many have argued the new policy siting: price, technology, and software programing as some of the reasons to maintain DJI inventory.
 

dougcjohn

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 13, 2019
Messages
91
Reaction score
22
Age
62
On a different similar tangent of Govt banning...
Govt Banned AntiMalware software by Kaspersky (a long time USA company), due to being Russian. No fact, no proof...just speculation during a time of the same. Kaspersky continues to be top market product, often taking the majority of the awards. In addition, the Kaspersky Labs (separate entity) perform many services to multiple malware companies that require new detection libraries.

Even after being banned... soon after the world experienced 2 cyber attacks: UK Hospitals & Finance and USA Healthcare. The Kaspersky Labs provided new definition files to fight the malware and since it worked so nicely, some attacked hinting Kaspersky created the malware, later proved false.

Govt Banning in this instance provided an opportunity for other USA companies to grab more market share, especially the Govt Sectors. Hmmm... familiar.
 

Latest threads

Members online

Forum statistics

Threads
431
Messages
3,684
Members
418
Latest member
Nemss430